Undercroft and the Legend that is Grimrock: Where Can We Go?

[Avantir]

I first purchased Legend of Grimrock because it appeared as a more modern version of the iOS game Undercroft (Which I have played WAAAAAAY too much of). I always liked comparing the two, and after noticing this old blog post (http://www.grimrock.net/2013/03/21/scra ... e-designs/) I decided to post this. I consider myself something of a growing expert on game design, educated by thousands of people gamers and non-gamers alike, many different game of different styles , genres, atmospheres and companies and multiple different true expert opinions.

OK, intro crap aside, the blog post above basically describes how the devs decided against turn based combat and an open world full of towns and areas to explore. Undercroft, in a way, had both of these aspects. You were stuck on a grid, in turn based combat in an open area (You had to progress through six areas to beat the game, so in that way it was linear but each area was more open world style). The devs didn't want Grimrock to lose that personal feeling you get from being in a dungeon and having to escape; a scenario that is personal to you and your party, a compact and focussed world. Yet somehow, Undercroft definitely kept this feel even in a completely different world. Your overall quest throughout the game was to win a bet, the "Bet of Your Life" and that kind of involved some really dangerous stuff and a long journey. It made you feel like you had to win, like no matter how many gates are jammed shut and no matter how many guards will not let you pass (Let me count… Five times there was a jerk guard who just stood there and said "Nope, can't go this way"), you HAD TO WIN. It kept this tight personal feeling where there was always somewhere to go and always something new to do or explore without wrapping you up and forcing you down a single path. By the end, you got this sort of "Congrats!" and you could stop and think "OK, it's not over yet and this is gonna be hard but I JUST DID THAT!". My point is that Grimrock, while being an excellent dungeon crawler, takes it a different way. It is more focussed on the descent through the dungeon and the mystery of it all. That's not bad, it's just that that is but one thing that can make Grimrock a magical experience. I think Grimrock 2 transitioning to the outside is wonderful idea, but I do hope the devs realize the potential of the genre they are using. Grimrock was pretty darn cool, but what we need in Grimrock 2 is not the same thing over again. We need this potential explored. I wanted to say that because I am slightly worried that the devs don't see it this way… I don't want anyone thinking that this is a niche genre or that all that can be done has been done; Never.

TLDR; This genre is not limited. It can be among the best, most intense and most exciting games out there.

On the subject of turn based systems, I agree with Almost Human on this one. Undercroft was turn based, and make no mistake it wasn't bad… But it had issues. In Undercroft you could turn the camera without taking up a turn, which seems to be why the devs decided against turn based (In their prototype, turning the camera was a move). In Undercroft, there were a couple things you could do to abuse the turn system, namely load-fight-repeat until you get a favourable turn, then save (Mind you if that wasn't a thing, Soloing the game would be impossible - As is, soloing the game is just time consuming - By solo I mean one party member). If you wanted to stop this you would have to implement crazy save/load restrictions, which I'm sure would drive players crazy.

P.S. Undercroft is a product of Jagex Game Studio.

P.S.S. Undercroft had few puzzles and fewer secrets, but their secrets are really good.

P.S.S.S. There was something I REALLY wanted to write here and now it's gone. D:

[Leki]

Well, you allways can "bring the potential of this gendre" to the stars with your own product. As a "growing expert on game design" I'm 100% sure you can achieve this in few weeks as part time job. I'm also sure, you can use your's great knowledge and expert skills and bring there the best from Ishars, Ultimas, EoBs, LoL, MaMs, RoAs, Amber/Albion, and hundreds rpg/dungeon games with "open air" parts

For Info:
Undercrof is originally years old czech dungeon made by Rake in Grass studio http://www.rakeingrass.com/games.php for PC. You can download PC demo here: http://freehry.doupe.zive.cz/recenze/un ... n/download
They made iOS version a years later.

For aditional info:
For iOS there is another remastered old czech dungeon called Gates of Skeldal : https://itunes.apple.com/cz/app/brany-s ... d794541238 it's free full game. Android and PC liks are here: http://bonusweb.idnes.cz/brany-skeldalu ... novinky_oz (find download box on the page) - but do it only if you are true old-school dungeons fan and wanna try it